AF Seal Trading

Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Zackan on Tue Dec 21, 2010 3:26 am

Daremo wrote:
Zackan wrote:why toss anything you 'might' need.. with all the gobbie bag quests, you have 240 slots in your satchel, inventory, and sack alone

another possible 80 in both locker, and storage so thats 400 slots, no reason to toss seals..


You're willing to give up nearly half your walking around inventory for something that 'Might come in handy someday'? Good luck with that. I suppose if you had lots of inventory before the mog sack came along you might be okay with wasting the entirety of it's added storage plus twenty more slots, but I don't think most people are in that situation.



and thats cuz most people have way to many jobs leveled... i call that crazy.. talented but crazy.. heh

i only have 2 jobs i really use. so i dont need 400 inventory slots, i still have, but dont use it all

plus with the fact they made more rare/ex storeable at npcs....
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby runeghost on Tue Dec 21, 2010 3:30 am

Plus, lets look at the current set up.
Dominion/Bastion Quests - Trivial effort, low chance of dropping, can drop any of the 20 job combinations.
Zone specific quests - Moderate effort (averaging all of them, the malachite quest is near impossible, but galka stuffing is easy), reasonable chance of dropping seal, can drop one of 4 possible combinations.
NM Fights - High effort (yes, some are soloable by certain jobs, but most are not, some are rather difficult with parties or require alliances), high chance of dropping seal (chance of dropping more than one), can drop one of 4 possible combinations.

With the most effort, and having friends, you should be able to get any specific ones fairly quickly.
With casual effort, and no friends, just popping in to do a bastion quest every hour or so, it will take a long time, but you will be able to measure your progress.

Comparing that these pieces (the +1) are superior in many ways to drops from Omega/Ultima, Kings, etc...alright, lets just take a random example.
Zenith pumps require a drop that comes off King Behemoth, Fafnirr, and Odin.
Soloable?
No. Even now require full parties to alliances. Any guarantee that you will get the pop? No, and you can wait four days without it popping at all, and competition was unreal. Usually went only to bots enough that most people on most servers didn't even bother trying.
Guarantee of drops once you get the pop? No.
Any way you can get it and not spend hours and hours hoping for a pop? Well, there is Odin... who has only a 10% of dropping it and with perfect coordination you can make one attempt every 12 days.

Are gathering seals annoying? yes, but keep remembering what we are -getting- here.

Blah.

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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Kin on Tue Dec 21, 2010 5:27 am

nightxade wrote:I agree with SIlkavenger. The people who are stressed about getting seals NOW are going to continue to be frustrated until SE delivers their seals to their delivery box :P


Not true. ^^;

I'm not demanding things be in my delivery box immediately. I like working. I like working hard. I like taking my time and at the end of it all, having a very powerful item to show off because of the hard work I put into it. I'm like this with real life too when it comes to school work.

I'd much rather +1ing things to be more like Trials of Magians weapons. Do a certain amount of work, and get the reward for it. I don't want the seals to just be delivered to me. But, if I do something in the game, I'd like to feel like I at least accomplished something.

The random system makes me feel like I'm wasting my valuable time playing a game, and then it makes me feel a bit ashamed of liking a game so much when it gets me nowhere and eventually, my desire to play crumbles. If I felt like I was at least accomplishing something every time I attempted to better my gear, I'd be a lot happier and more willing to continue my play.

I think a lot of the upset people are more from my point of view than the one you're painting for us. I don't know of anyone who just wants things handed to them. That makes life really boring and the things you obtain have no value. I don't mind it taking the same amount of time it has already taken me (two and a half weeks, 6/8 BLM seals, done the quest 77 times), but I'd like to at least feel every time I do the quest, I'm a step closer.

Whether it's through trading in 10~20 unwanted seals for 1 wanted seal, or having a system like ToM where we have to defeat a NM 20-30 times, I'd like to see a little change. ^^
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Ecaroh on Tue Dec 21, 2010 6:49 pm

I got 12 WHM feet seals. Anyone want to trade for SAM seal. I have one SAM seal from that Bad Communication quest.

NOW that is STUPID and "very bad Communication" LOL

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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby nightxade on Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:10 pm

Kin wrote:I think a lot of the upset people are more from my point of view than the one you're painting for us. I don't know of anyone who just wants things handed to them. That makes life really boring and the things you obtain have no value. I don't mind it taking the same amount of time it has already taken me (two and a half weeks, 6/8 BLM seals, done the quest 77 times), but I'd like to at least feel every time I do the quest, I'm a step closer.


DOn't get me wrong, I understand the frustration as I have been through it. Consequently, I've learned from it.

INitially I wasted time spamming leg quest seals. I have all my legs now as a reward, but my stone stock was poofed. Now, I try to be more productive and less stressed about it. As in, I really don't enter Abyssea with the intention of obtaining seals. If we're going into a specific zone to do something, then I will do the particular quests. If my friends are farming specific seal NMs, then I will go with to help. If I'm lucky, it will be NMs that drop seals I need too. Otherwise, I'm getting merits and having fun.

People who want seals and want them now are going to spam these quests and NMs and are going to be frustrated by the randomness of watching the pot, waiting for it to boil. Do you *need* this gear *now*? If you can survive without it, then why stress yourself by spamming a quest 77 times? THe game is what you make it. If you want that stuff ASAP, then the drop rate is going to cause you frustration. If you can be more relaxed about it, then the game will remain fun.

Still, as I said, I appreciate the frustration and would not be opposed to a trade in system to make the process that much less frustrating. Honestly, I would have liked to see Empyrean Gear get a more interesting trial process. Something that would have allowed us to customize our gear by following different paths. Like ToM weapons, there probably would have been a lot of frustration in this way, but at least, as you said, each step in the process would bring you closer.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Kin on Thu Dec 23, 2010 1:11 am

I finally finished last night. Went 8/81.

It wasn't really stress. I would do it if it was near the end of a Vana'diel day or whenever an activity ended and a new Vana'diel day was up. It took five minutes. It wasn't as if I wasted stones on it, I would just go when I was in Port Jeuno and saw a good opportunity to go.

The only stress I felt was the constant lack of reward. But on the talk page, people have noticed answering incorrectly seems to not give seals now. Since I started collecting all three answers, I got my last two seals incredibly quick. Three extra minutes of running for a much higher percentage is worth it.

I'll continue to strive for quests in the other slots. I don't like asking for help and I don't like bumming if I can help it. But like I said, even if I had to do the quest 80 times to still get my +1, it would have been nice if each time I did it, I got closer. A guaranteed closer. Even if the quest had to be done 100 times for a completed piece of armor, each attempt would bring the player 1% closer to completion!
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Tahngarthor on Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:26 am

The key reason for the furstration is the randomness. Sure, you do get seals, but unless you have every job leveled, you often get things you don't want- and this doesn't really end up making you feel any better than not getting something at all.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Taube on Thu Dec 23, 2010 10:32 am

Would be nice if the quests only gave seals for jobs you have 65+ or something.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby KingOfZeal on Thu Dec 23, 2010 6:50 pm

Honestly I would be fine if the seals would drop to say the treasure pool instead of directly to you. Leave them Ex and untradable, but at least let the one or two of us who are doing the same quest be able to pool and share our rewards. While working on my PUP body I got 15 BLU bodies (and now have a +1 BLU body in storage that I'll never touch), and almost got a +1 RNG and WAR body as well. I'm sure there's a BLU out there right now who has been getting tons of PUP seals. Exploitable? Perhaps, but it would go a long way to settling the problems people have.

I'd also be happy with NPC seal trading: if you figure each seal has a 4% chance to drop (1/25), then you would get 1 of each kind of job in 25 runs, which means 3:1 or 4:1 unwanted:wanted (assuming you only want one job). An exchange rate of 5:1 or 10:1 would keep things in balance without having to adjust quest drop rates. It would also help when getting drops from NMs that nobody needs anymore (SCH legs in my group, for example). They can go freelot for eventual exchange for what they need.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby nightxade on Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:27 pm

Kin wrote:I finally finished last night. Went 8/81.


Congratulations on finishing up! :) I assume you are talking about Slacking Subordinates? That one drops 3 seals I need, so when I am motivated, I'm going to start spamming that one. Unfortunately, my leg spamming ordeal has turned me off of that, so I've found better things to do in the mean time. I'll get to it though! I'm dreading talking to Brygid for my BST though ><
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Ravenbe_Genji on Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:13 pm

My only problem with this system is myself: I've fallen prey to the Gambler's Fallacy alot with the quests & ops.

Mainly I need to slow down in my time in aby unless it is of benefit to me or friends (I can always get a skill up situation with mobs). Exp is no longer as big of an incentive as I've capped everything... XD
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby nightxade on Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:25 pm

My problem with questing is that I'm always so easily distracted. I need to do it when few people are in the LS and in need of my help (or just take the pearl off) and I need to do it on a job that won't be tempted to solo things like Ironclad Executioner, who is now persistently in the way of my Vunk feet questing.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby scaevola on Thu Jan 06, 2011 7:59 pm

I can't help but have some reservations about a system that makes just being able to consistently solo a Scars NM that much more of a game-breaking benefit.

Which is not to say I think it's a bad idea; it's just that the more I farm these suckers, the more convinced I become that literally any job could do this in its sleep with Curing Waltz III and enough HP. The AGI > Subtle Blow change probably needs to be scaled back a bit; right now it's just way too good. The big bad NM with the nasty 1200-point unblinkable TP move isn't so scary when it takes 3 minutes of you wailing on him to build enough TP to use it, and you've got 2500 HP anyway.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Tahngarthor on Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:53 am

why toss anything you 'might' need.
Because I've already filled up most of that space with other things I thought I 'might' need.
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Re: AF Seal Trading

Postby Kin on Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:59 pm

nightxade wrote:
Kin wrote:I finally finished last night. Went 8/81.


Congratulations on finishing up! :) I assume you are talking about Slacking Subordinates?


Thank you! ^^

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